Friday, February 15, 2008

Stop the Fratricide! A Case of Friendly Fire ...




With truth comes power. The power to free the oppressed. The power to correct an injustice. The power to inflict mortal wounds.

The quest for truth is a worthy pursuit, but comes with a great responsibility to exercise caution – to be mindful at all times of the innocent bystanders in our midst. We also have a responsibility to protect those who would desire to help in whatever way they can, but who have to balance that cooperation with the risk of exposure to either a real or perceived enemy.

In recent days I have witnessed a case of friendly fire – the wounding of a person who was simply trying to lend aid to the cause of taking down Kimkins and Heidi Diaz in the only way they knew how. This person feared detection and so they attempted to communicate in a cryptic and at times a seemingly nonsensical fashion. All such attempts are met with a measure of skepticism initially. That is only prudent. After all, this is a tale of intrigue, deception, impersonation … The stakes are far too high to simply accept all newcomers claiming to hold one of the keys to this puzzle at face value. However, not only wisdom, but simple compassion dictates how we respond to such messengers, particularly in the public eye. Well meaning people can and have been hurt by the reckless disregard of some of those intent on seeing this fiasco to its conclusion. A basic tenet that I learned while training to be an emergency care provider would serve us well here … First, do no harm.

In this particular case, a genuine and viable asset has likely been driven completely away. We must entertain the real possibility that this person does indeed have information that could have a major impact on the final outcome of this proceeding.

To the individual who presented themselves recently as Martina’s Martini on the Fascination with Kimmer threads within the Low Carb Friends forum, I offer a sincere apology for any unfounded accusations that may have been leveled in your direction by some of those intensely focused on this particular quest. These are good people who, at times, get a bit caught up in the moment. But friendly fire, regardless of the intention, is never justified. We simply must stop the fratricide if we are to distinguish ourselves from those whom we oppose.

Fellow searchers, please exercise wisdom while pursuing leads, whether the subject is Kimkins or the Magic Chicken Diet or the next scam down the line. Speculation with a basis in facts, even if limited, is far different than arrows simply shot in the dark. Words do wound. And those words espoused on the internet will live on for a lifetime.

35 comments:

Kat said...

I need to offer my sincere apology to MM also...I jumped the gun and got gun shy and I was wrong. I appreciated trust she put in me and showed it in a bad way. I'm sorry.

Yucky's Crow Eaters Inc. said...

We're sorry. We were wrong. But now we have solid information and we REALLY know who "Martina's Martini" is. Check it out -- is it just a coincidence that "Martina" stages a grand entrance in the fascination thread at the exact same moment that "Dottie" staged a grand "return" to that exact same thread? Is it just a coincidence that "Martina" loves to hit that delete button on her own posts and that "Dottie" love to hit that delete button on everybody else's posts? Ta DAH -- mystery solved -- "Martina" is really DOTTIE.

That's our story and we're stickin to it :)

TerryC said...

Unless you truly know who this person is and what their motives were, I am going to have to disagree that this person was offering help. Although most of the evidence is now gone, when this person first came into the thread they told us that enough had been done and let the courts take the rest from there. We should all be moving on. A series of posts told this person thank you but no thank you. Then there was a series of cryptic and strange posts that made no sense with a lot of smileys and lol's. There was some fixation with Kat and this person could have just contacted Kat from behind the scenes at her blog if they wanted to help. So, unless you truly know something that you can't tell us, then I am not buying that this was friendly fire. I think it was just someone having fun with us for a while.

Mayberryfan said...

Hmmmmmm. I don't recall anyone being particularly mean to MM. Snarky? Yeah. Cautious? Ditto. In any case, someone who appears out of no where and appears SO erratic is inviting a little snark. I can't really see the harm.

2BIG said...

if one wants to avoid friendly fire one needs to be open and honest in ones approach. And not tell folk the law is handling it and to move on.


While I don't believe Martina is Kimmer she could have easily avoided the drama had she wanted.

since Martina reads many blogs as she had key words from many in the crypric messages had she simply wanted to give as her final blog post said info to john she could have sent the message herself to John using a thow away hotmail email addy, posted a comment on any blog that has commnet moderation on (Kat's for example) and said please pass this info on to John but don't post it, or even called john's office as John's address email and phone number are a matter of record and can be accesses with a simple website read.

kimkinscam said...

IMHO - Martina came into the thread with an agenda. And NOT the agenda of offering help to the case but to put the ducks in their place. We were told to move on (which isn't anything new - plenty of others have said the same) and then handed a whole bunch of sarcastic comments (ie. kimmer being on the grassy knoll, geeez!etc.) There were 'come on people, get a life' comments and then lots of incomprehensible remarks and snarkiness from "her". IF she was to be taken seriously and with compassion, this sure didn't seem to be the smartest way to get there. The ducks have been criticized plenty and scolded more times then not. So for someone to think they could "pop in" to the thread, speaking the way she did, and not be "fired upon" is beyond comprehension to me. What reaction did she think she'd get?
If what you're saying is that this person had information and was just trying to get it to the right person, then why all the drama? Why all the sarcastic remarks? Why not just say, "hey, I've got info and want to get it to John". I am certain, had that happened, Martina would have received a much different response. Nope! I'm not buying into the idea that Martina was mistreated! Not this time. In the past, maybe some have received some unnecessary snarkiness - but IMO the ducks have learned from that and have been wise and careful in their responses to trolls.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Prudentia said...

I'm listening. If you don't want something posted publically, tell me.

Prudentia said...

Okay, I moved them out of public view. Before I do the other, why that particular person? I have another path.

Prudentia said...

I will tell her that. This must be very difficult for you. Why would anyone care what she does? Why would that matter?

Prudentia said...

That part will be taken care of, I promise you. Would JT know what you are talking about by what you have just told me?

Magicsmom said...

Others have already said it better than I could, but from my POV, Martina came to the thread to stir the pot. That was the only apparent motive. There was no information provided, only cryptic messages shrouded in mystery as to what they really meant. All I can say is, if you don't want to be treated as a troll, then don't act like one. Until Martina proves he/she has anything of consequence to say, I will continue to believe he/she is a troll, and was treated appropriately. It is not up to anyone to tell me what to do with my time and life.

Prudentia said...

You're welcome. And I'll listen as long as you need me to.

I'm sorry you are so afraid. I wish I could fix that for you.

Prudentia said...

Hi Magicsmom! Welcome to the blog! Your post is showing up in the middle of a conversation, so just ignore my ramblings here ...

Prudentia said...

Okay ... I get what you've said. I just can't figure out WHY. WHY would that matter? Is there a connection?

Prudentia said...

LOL! You did do that, for sure. Not everyone thinks that way, though. Know that. Again, I'll listen as long as you need/want to talk. And you're welcome.

Prudentia said...

Cool. Taken care of. Be sure and give me the high sign when you're in the area.

Prudentia said...

I mean the blog.

Prudentia said...

You already told her that, so I won't be telling her again. LOL

Stop back. And if you think of anything else, the line is always open.

Good luck to you.

Prudentia said...

You, too. It's been sent.

HoneyBee said...

Ummm.......I think I missed something again.LOL
I will have to let others fill in the blanks. But I have been uncertain as to how to take the Martina posts. I have taken them as clues and tried to work through them. I have also worked through the process of it being a diversion.
At this time both seem viable options to me. So I would say at this point I am Switzerland!

Prudentia said...

They were persistent, that's for sure. As for the other, well Ducks do what Ducks do.

Prudentia said...

How can I ask for clarification of a specific piece of information?

HoneyBee said...

....Testing...one..two..three..

"You talkin' to me?" said in my most convincing De Niro voice.

Prudentia said...

Sorry, HoneyBee ... I know it looks like I'm talking to myself, but I'm not. Really. You just came in the middle of a conversation. You are welcome to post, that's for sure! Should have been more clear, though, that I wasn't addressing you.

Prudentia said...

At this point, terryc, I believe I know as much as I need to about who they are and do believe this person is real. The info they provided has been passed on.

Or they are really good, I'm a fool, and have passed on a fairy tale.

Time will tell.

Prudentia said...

Yes, I saw it and I understand.

Prudentia said...

Elle, email me ...

2BIG said...

so MM went from trusting only Kat to now prudentia? and now ony communicates in comments deleted to you, but you must reply as a posted commnets back?

this is beyond crazy.

Prudentia said...

I had no email address to reply to and didn't request one, either. Nice thing about owning the blog ... you can do that. I did not post MM's comments as I was honoring their request.

Prudentia said...

2Big, I received your comments, and thank you for them, however I am not willing to cross post from FWK threads in this particular matter.

First, this specific blog post served its purpose, which was to allow a place for MM to communicate what they had to share in an environment where someone was willing to listen.

Second, as to the concept of Friendly Fire, you must let your own conscious guide you in this matter. In this particular case I noticed a distinct difference between MM's postings and those of previous "trolls" on the forum. The initial messages, I believe, were designed to get attention, and once that was gotten, MM tried to begin to relay information. At that point, people were not willing to listen. It is easy to read through the progression of that particular thread and see how the situation quickly deteriorated with one side feeding off of the other. If you are fortunate to have captured those screens before they were censored, I'd encourage you to go back and read them with an unbiased eye.

In a neat little world people would enter our arena and follow our neat little rules of engagement. That is rarely reality, however. If our true purpose is dialog, we have to be willing to maneuver ourselves into a position to actual hear the other party speak. Whether or not you individually or collectively choose to do that is entirely up to you. I'm not passing judgment on you. I do fear, however, that other pieces of information, perhaps vital to this matter, are getting lost in the intensity of the battle.

I believe it is also important to realize that people have various things happening in their personal worlds that color they way they view things and the way they communicate. What may seem simple to one may be very complex to another. What may seem safe to one may be very dangerous or risky to another. There are many things that will determine the lens that one looks through, including past and present environment and experiences. We can't presume to know how another person should act unless we are willing to first find out what is driving them.

MM is an interesting individual. I'm glad I took the time to acquaint myself with them. It would not be in their best interest at this point in time to expose their identity. But I will tell you that this is an individual to whom we all owe a great debt of gratitude for the sacrifices they have made on our behalf. If for no other reason, I owe MM respect and appreciation. And they will get that from me.

2BIHG said...

I was there and read them as they were posted those 4 I posted in my commnet were before any censorship of the topic occurred. I'm surprised you would censor this since you feel MM caught friendly fire and was an innoncent with a message to help.
MM arrived and basically insulted all who continue to post and discuss Kimkins and kimmer in the topic. the opening post of the grassy knoll and then saying they had lost 650 pounds and for those posting to get alife and move on were not those of some one acting friendly.
For you to say that was to get attention so their message could be posted is ridiculous. Many have arrived new to the topic and shared their info as the poster with the check the russian sites did with the first found fake Kimmer pic.
MM could ahve just posted it or they could have as I mentioned in the discussion gone to a blog with commnet moderation on and said I need to get some info to John for the law suit and passed it that way without drawing any attention to themselves nor insulting the inteligence of those actively posting in the FWK topic.

To call it any thing else is insulting to all ducks and lecturing us about listening to a new person is just as wrong. If one arrives in the facination topic and plays games and insults the posters one will be thought of as they should a troll and any imformation they might want to pass on no matter how valuble it could be will be judged suspect.

As my grandfather so aptly said a person is only as good as their word and MM's words were not those of a friend.

Magicsmom said...

On Sunday night, I got a very interesting PM from someone who may identify herself if she wishes. Let it go on record I am NOT the person who reported MM to the admins. I did NOT request for MM's posts to be removed. It seems that I am being accused of this by someone who is clueLESS about the situation, and suffice it to say, I am a little more than miffed about it. People should not go around accusing people of things unless they know what they're talking about. A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.

Prudentia said...

Not sure, Magicsmom, why you brought this comment here instead of LCF, but I'm happy to post it for you.